Methotrexate injection for psoriasis 52 week study

[D Foster]

The main problem with MTX is that it is the old saying "give a dog a bad name" and that name is CANCER which is the reason that it was used in the first place so now it has this spectre in the back of peoples mind which they probably don't even acknowledge or realise but it is there and it now suffers from this and carries the prejudice with it and I suppose fear as well.

And it's also used for ectopic pregnancy. A drug used for that and cancer is not suitable for people with psoriasis.

It's a poison and should be banned for use with psoriasis patients. When you read most of the comments on Psoriasis Club about methotrexate from our members most have a negative opinions about it. Yes it works and some can handle it, but things have changed and there are better treatments out there than poison.

All things are poison and nothing is without poison, only the dosage makes a thing not poison. This is often condensed to: "The dose makes the poison" or in Latin "Sola dosis facit venenum". It means that a substance can produce the harmful effect associated with its toxic properties only if it reaches a susceptible biological system within the body in a high enough concentration .
The principle relies on the finding that all chemicals—even water and oxygen—can be toxic if too much is eaten, drunk, or absorbed. "The toxicity of any particular chemical depends on many factors, including the extent to which it enters an individual’s body. This finding provides also the basis for public health standards, which specify maximum acceptable concentrations of various contaminants in food, public drinking water, and the environment.
I’ll give you an very common example: Aspirin. Aspirin, as many of you know, is acetylsalicylic acid. This particular molecule irreversibly inhibits an enzyme called cyclooxygenase (COX), which is involved in the production of mediators of inflammation, among other things. The exact details aren’t important, such as how aspirin inhibits the COX1 version more than COX 2 or how it does so by attaching an acetyl chemical group to the active site of the enzyme. The point is that aspirin permanently inactivates an enzyme. It poisons the cell. That’s how it works. In fact, when used as a “blood thinner,” aspirin permanently poisons a certain kind of cell, namely the platelet. Because a platelet doesn’t have a nucleus, it can’t make more COX. What it has when it’s made is all that it will ever have, and if that COX is irreversibly blocked, that platelet’s function is impaired for the rest of its lifespan. Again, without getting too technical, that’s how aspirin works as a blood thinner. It’s an antiplatelet drug.

[mataribot]

MTX is relatively safe for a short duration treatment of psoriasis (about a year). It's safety profile drops considerably the longer you take it. There are new treatments available that overall have a better long term safety profile.

[Fred]

The main problem with MTX is that it is the old saying "give a dog a bad name" and that name is CANCER which is the reason that it was used in the first place so now it has this spectre in the back of peoples mind which they probably don't even acknowledge or realise but it is there and it now suffers from this and carries the prejudice with it and I suppose fear as well.

And it's also used for ectopic pregnancy. A drug used for that and cancer is not suitable for people with psoriasis.

It's a poison and should be banned for use with psoriasis patients. When you read most of the comments on Psoriasis Club about methotrexate from our members most have a negative opinions about it. Yes it works and some can handle it, but things have changed and there are better treatments out there than poison.

All things are poison and nothing is without poison, only the dosage makes a thing not poison. This is often condensed to: "The dose makes the poison" or in Latin "Sola dosis facit venenum". It means that a substance can produce the harmful effect associated with its toxic properties only if it reaches a susceptible biological system within the body in a high enough concentration .
The principle relies on the finding that all chemicals—even water and oxygen—can be toxic if too much is eaten, drunk, or absorbed. "The toxicity of any particular chemical depends on many factors, including the extent to which it enters an individual’s body. This finding provides also the basis for public health standards, which specify maximum acceptable concentrations of various contaminants in food, public drinking water, and the environment.
I’ll give you an very common example: Aspirin. Aspirin, as many of you know, is acetylsalicylic acid. This particular molecule irreversibly inhibits an enzyme called cyclooxygenase (COX), which is involved in the production of mediators of inflammation, among other things. The exact details aren’t important, such as how aspirin inhibits the COX1 version more than COX 2 or how it does so by attaching an acetyl chemical group to the active site of the enzyme. The point is that aspirin permanently inactivates an enzyme. It poisons the cell. That’s how it works. In fact, when used as a “blood thinner,” aspirin permanently poisons a certain kind of cell, namely the platelet. Because a platelet doesn’t have a nucleus, it can’t make more COX. What it has when it’s made is all that it will ever have, and if that COX is irreversibly blocked, that platelet’s function is impaired for the rest of its lifespan. Again, without getting too technical, that’s how aspirin works as a blood thinner. It’s an antiplatelet drug.

You bean on the Gin again Dave.  

Methotrexate is poison as far as I'm concerned and should no longer be used to treat psoriasis.  

I'll leave you to it.  

[D Foster]

The main problem with MTX is that it is the old saying "give a dog a bad name" and that name is CANCER which is the reason that it was used in the first place so now it has this spectre in the back of peoples mind which they probably don't even acknowledge or realise but it is there and it now suffers from this and carries the prejudice with it and I suppose fear as well.

And it's also used for ectopic pregnancy. A drug used for that and cancer is not suitable for people with psoriasis.

It's a poison and should be banned for use with psoriasis patients. When you read most of the comments on Psoriasis Club about methotrexate from our members most have a negative opinions about it. Yes it works and some can handle it, but things have changed and there are better treatments out there than poison.

All things are poison and nothing is without poison, only the dosage makes a thing not poison. This is often condensed to: "The dose makes the poison" or in Latin "Sola dosis facit venenum". It means that a substance can produce the harmful effect associated with its toxic properties only if it reaches a susceptible biological system within the body in a high enough concentration .
The principle relies on the finding that all chemicals—even water and oxygen—can be toxic if too much is eaten, drunk, or absorbed. "The toxicity of any particular chemical depends on many factors, including the extent to which it enters an individual’s body. This finding provides also the basis for public health standards, which specify maximum acceptable concentrations of various contaminants in food, public drinking water, and the environment.
I’ll give you an very common example: Aspirin. Aspirin, as many of you know, is acetylsalicylic acid. This particular molecule irreversibly inhibits an enzyme called cyclooxygenase (COX), which is involved in the production of mediators of inflammation, among other things. The exact details aren’t important, such as how aspirin inhibits the COX1 version more than COX 2 or how it does so by attaching an acetyl chemical group to the active site of the enzyme. The point is that aspirin permanently inactivates an enzyme. It poisons the cell. That’s how it works. In fact, when used as a “blood thinner,” aspirin permanently poisons a certain kind of cell, namely the platelet. Because a platelet doesn’t have a nucleus, it can’t make more COX. What it has when it’s made is all that it will ever have, and if that COX is irreversibly blocked, that platelet’s function is impaired for the rest of its lifespan. Again, without getting too technical, that’s how aspirin works as a blood thinner. It’s an antiplatelet drug.

You bean on the Gin again Dave.  

Methotrexate is poison as far as I'm concerned and should no longer be used to treat psoriasis.  

I'll leave you to it.  

I always get serious when I get down Fred , my sense of humour tends to have a day off , I have not been on the gin yet but I tell you what Fred I have just got a great bottle of vintage port and later I do intend to make sure that I check to see that it's OK.
By the way Fred you are wrong !!!!

[mataribot]

MTX is essentially Chemo; by definition it's poison.

[D Foster]

MTX is essentially Chemo; by definition it's poison.

Of course it's not a poison , I would think that there are many people who owe their life to MTX , as I said all things are poison even water in the wrong quantity.
The statement that because it's used for chemotherapy then it's a poison rather overlooks the fact that its used to save lives which contradicts the statement rather.

[jiml]

I've read through this thread and note that there are some very strong personal views, and whilst I like a discussion about the effectiveness of one drug against another I do think this thread has gone away from the point of the study, and I think we should try to limit our comments to the original study, rather than get into arguments about the value of methotrexate as a Psoriasis drug